I don't expect anyone will be able to find the exact right chemical I need for a story, so instead I
need enough jargon to convince people that my fictional chemical is real. It needs to:

1) Vaporize at very low pressures (near vacuum conditions)
2) Be rapidly paralitic when inhaled.
3) Be something that could rationally be found in a lunar ice-mining operation, maybe as a solvent
or lubricant.
4) Either have these properties readily available via the MSDS or have other properties that make
it a commonly-known recreational drug.

Any ideas?
 

Message #1176 left by John Savage on Jan 21, 2000 at 18:03

ethyl ethyl ether (commonly known as "ether") seems to fit. It's definitely a vapor at low pressure,
it'll knock you right in high concentration out, it's a critical solvent in many large-scale chemical
processes (although Mark will probably list some less-toxic replacements), and it used to be used a
recreational drug.

I'd imagine that WD-40 and the like could also be used as recreational drugs, to ensure that those
two brain cells really don't rub together.
 

Message #1178 left by Mark Rapacioli on Jan 22, 2000 at 9:49

Paul, I was thinking of chloroform, but diethyl ether (ether) might be OK. The problem is, while
both are vapors at extremely low pressures and lunar temperatures, they would make crappy
solvents under such conditions. You couldn't use them in an ice-mining environment unless the
teperature was high enough. Since chloroform has a higher boiling point, it's easier to liquefy and
use as a solvent than diethyl ether, so that's probably a better choice, even though diethyl ether's
paralytic effect is more pronounced.

Hmmmm, perhaps ethanol is a better choice, as far as feasibility as a solvent and being a vapor at
very low pressures -- but of course it probably isn't as paralytic as diethyl ether or chloroform.

As for a less toxic choice, good luck finding one. The fact that a chemical has paralytic properties
pretty much makes it a toxic chemical.
 

Message #1180 left by Dionys Murphy on Jan 23, 2000 at 15:48

Regarding Ether: If Diethyl Ether polymerizes (or crystalizes, I don't remember which) you're in
deep do-do. When this happens on earth, the bomb squad is called. As it is in its natural state, it's
extremely flammable.
 

Message #1182 left by Martin on Jan 23, 2000 at 17:18

Most solvents commonly used at normal temperature and pressure will rapidly vapourise under
high vacuum and do you no good at all if inhaled. I believe butane is a substance of abuse for
solvent inhalers and is a commonly used fuel. Plenty of reason for that to be used in a mining
camp for lighting or heating.
 

Message #1183 left by Andrew on Jan 24, 2000 at 8:34

Either that or your ice miners are using the ethanol from the sickkbay/ antifreeze in the base
hydraulics/ other industrial process in use on base and applying a process of kitchen chemistry (I
forget the details, but it was certainly available to poor-ish folks in the 19th century) to make
ether.

Drinking the stuff used to be fairly popular, and it produced a short, powerful high with little in the
way of hangover. Ideal for guys in a hostile environment who want a bit of light relief but don't
want to be fuzzy on duty.

Plus, if it's being made in a bucket in the head, it's far more likely to get loose in the air supply than
the official chemicals on base, whose handling will have been carefully engineered.

You'll need to look up some social history - I ran across it in a "made for tourists" book on Poitin I
picked up in a jumble sale a while ago.
 

Message #1184 left by Jeet Sukumaran on Jan 24, 2000 at 10:02

Re: getting buzzes of volatile substances ...

Hopefully, this link to a deja news message will come out right.

http://x30.deja.com/[ST_rn=ps]/getdoc.xp?AN=557882837&search=thread&CONTEXT=948725
340.596246536&HIT_CONTEXT=948725340.596246536&hitnum=2

If not, do a deja news search for "pink lady ethanol," and check out the thread entitled "Pink Lady
torpedo fuel/USS Sperry."

Basically the thread deals with various ways naval servicemen tried/try to get high using "stock"
chemicals on board, from circuit board cleaning fluids to denatured alcohol used as torpedo fuel
(this is the "pink lady": the navy added pink coloring to the stuff to indicate it was not meant for
consumption .. supposedly). Quite interesting, and may provide leads on how to work the chemical
in your story into the day-to-day activities of the mining concern. As well as point out the lengths
your miners might go to to add a little bit of spice to their lives.

Ken: thanks for the link; I'll check it out.
-- jeet
 

Message #1185 left by Martin on Jan 24, 2000 at 10:46

Diethyl ether can be made from ethanol by heating under pressure in the presence of certain clays.
 

Message #1186 left by Jay Arr on Jan 25, 2000 at 9:18

For some reason, this whole discussion makes me think of Sterno. Yes, it can be drunk and
produces a high. Continued uses produces blindness, though.
 

Message #1187 left by Mark Rapacioli on Jan 26, 2000 at 9:13

That's because the main ingredient in Sterno is methanol.
 

Message #1188 left by John Savage on Jan 26, 2000 at 11:03

Methanol, one might add, is a poison of far greater potency than ethanol, but less than isopropyl
alcohols. Apparently, the only simple alcohol that crosses the blood-brain barrier that is also
non-poisonous (in the technical sense; yes, ethanol is poisonous in ridiculously large doses) is
ethanol, C2H5OH.
 

Message #1189 left by Sullydog on Jan 26, 2000 at 15:21

Sorry, John, incorrect. And since all emergency physicians are 1/3 toxicologist by weight, you've
just pushed one of my buttons and you're about to learn far more about intoxication with alcohols
than you ever wanted to know.

Methanol is *the* most poisonous of the alcohols. It is metabolized by the liver enzyme alcohol
dehydrogenase to yield formic acid. This causes what's known as an *anion gap metabolic
acidosis* (AGMA) An AGMA is diagnosed whenever one notes metabolic acidosis in conjunction
with the presence of an unmeasured organic anion (acid) in the serum--in this case methanol.*
Methanol intoxication causes a profound blood acidosis, and is one of the few conditions in which
the serum bicarbonate can reach a value of zero (!) As little as 30cc of methanol can cause death
within hours. Without treatment it leads rapidly to neuronal damage, shock, multiorgan system
failure, and death. Sometimes even with treatment...

Ethylene glycol, while technically not an alcohol (it is a poly-ol, or glycol) is also metabolized by
alcohol dehydrogenase, into oxacloacetate and other toxic products. Therefore, it also presents as
an AGMA, and can lead to shock and death.

Isopropyl (rubbing) alcohol, on the other hand, presents with a relatively benign picture. Twice as
intoxicating as ethanol, its primary toxicity is gastrointestinal--it is *very* irritating to the GI tract,
and can present with abdominal pain and GI bleeding readily controlled with sucralfate and
cimetidine (tagamet); blood transfusions are ocassionally necessary. Like other alcohols,
isopropanol is a substrate for alcohol dehydrogenase, but because of its symmetric structure (it is
not a terminal alcohol) it is metabolized to acetone, which is not an acid--so no AGMA. Instead,
isopropanol causes an *osmolar gap*, caused by unmeasured osmoles in the serum (in this case
acetone). Treatment is supportive; prognosis excellent.

For intoxication with toxic alcohols, the treatment is intensive, but the cornerstone of management
is -- booze! Administration of ethanol ties up alcohol dehydrogenase, so it's too busy to convert
methanol or ethylene glycol into toxic metabolites. Recently, a non-alcohol AD inhibitor was
licensed for clinical use, but since it's more untested and considerably less expensive than ethanol,
we haven't used it at DRH.

Whew! I feel better.

* FOR GEEKS ONLY: The differential diagnosis of an AGMA is a common clinical task in
emergency and critical care medicine, and is covered by the mnemonic MUDPILES:

M==methanol
U==uremia
D==diabetic ketoacidosis
P==paraldehyde
I==iron and isoniazid
L==lactic acidosis
E==ethanol
S==salicylates (aspirin)

All of which lead to unmeasured organic anions in serum. If anybody actually wants to know what
I mean by "unmeasured organic anions," just say so, and once I've recovered from shock I'll tell
you.
 

Message #1190 left by Sullydog on Jan 26, 2000 at 15:29

Two corrections:

The unmeasured organic anion in methanol poisoning is formate, not methanol.

The new AD inhibitor is MORE expensive, not less.

Sheesh. Maybe I should lay off the Sterno.
 

Message #1191 left by Barry on Jan 26, 2000 at 15:43

Sullydog, this isn't important, but when a hugely pregnant ewe gets toxic, or toxemia to quote my
wife the OB nurse, we give her propylene glycol, and it usually works. Diagnosis is easy, if it's bad
enough you can smell the acetone on their breath as soon as you go into the barn and then it's a
matter of figuring out which one. Sometimes you don't notice it until you get closer, but it's
unmistakable. Sheep are natures chemistry sets. The doctors that my wife works for don't believe
her when she tells them that, but any veterinarian in the world knows.
 

Message #1192 left by Sullydog on Jan 26, 2000 at 15:53

Propylene glycol is not without its own toxicity, but its widely used as a diluent for iv medications
(like Dilantin, frex). Compared to EG, it's nectar.
 

Message #1194 left by Gregory Koster on Jan 26, 2000 at 17:44

For Sullydog: Just what the world needs, a disease that requires alcoholic ingestion for treatment!
And can you tell me (Iflunked organic chemistry in my undergraduate days, which is why I ended
up in a public library) why methanol is so toxic to the eye?

Best regards,
Gregory Koster
 

Message #1195 left by John Savage on Jan 26, 2000 at 18:31

Hmm, Sullydog. I thought I was saying the same thing in less-technical language: The
"intoxicating" alcohols aside from ethanol are all worse. And let's not get into fumes from liquid
acetates, ok? Or aromatic esters. Or, for that matter, any aromatics.

Speaking of aromatics, that "kids sniffing paint" stuff is based on aromatic compounds, usually
toluene ( [C6H5]CH3 ) and xylene ( H3C[C6H4]CH3 ), which are far nastier in effect than the
alcohols. These are not the paint, but the propellant and solvent mixture. (And the formerly
common benzene ( [C6H6] ) is even worse.) Nonetheless, these are all common, irreplaceable
(with current technology) industrial solvents. Not lubricants, but I can certainly imagine using a
benzene or toluene wash as part of ore processing.

It's been a long time since I did ER stuff, Sullydog. Sorry if my initial post wasn't clear enough.
 

Message #1196 left by Sullydog on Jan 26, 2000 at 20:06

Sorry, John, maybe I misunderstood. You said methanol was more toxic ethanol, but less than
isopropanol. That was the part that pushed my "regurgitate toxic alcohols lecture" button. ;-) Other
than that, I *did* agree with your excellent post.

I'm happy to say that we don't see as much intoxication with the inhalant stuff anymore, especially
the aromatics like toluene, but those things tend to go in cycles. (Get it? Cycles? Aromatics? Har! I
love chemical humor!)
 

Message #1197 left by Sullydog on Jan 26, 2000 at 20:23

Greg: the neurons in the retina are exquisitely sensitive to formic acid, a metabolite of methanol,
and also to methanol itself. There's some neurons in the brain that don't like it much either (a false
distinction--the is part of the brain, but you know what I mean).

There's a new study in the current issue of Neuroscience which makes me wonder if daily
introcular injections of insulin-like-growth factor might not slow or halt the loss of retinal neurons.
We shall see. (Get it? Retinal neurons? See? Har! Sullydog should do standup!)
 

Message #1207 left by Mary on Jan 29, 2000 at 13:52

Thanks to my sister the chemistry major, who took Toxicology in college, I can point people who
disbelieve Sullydog to Casarett and Doull's Toxicology, Third Edition, p.503.
 

Message #1208 left by Sullydog on Jan 29, 2000 at 16:58

For those of us who instead use Goldfrank (THE Standard reference in clinical toxicology),
Haddad, Rosen or Tintinalli, perhaps you can just tell us what it says on page 503.

Unfortunately, I am at home, not the lab, and the only reference I have handy to give is Cecil's
Textbook of Medicine, 18th addition. See volume 1, page 142: "Inhibition of metabolism of a
potential toxin to its active form or conversion to an inactive form is an option and, when feasible,
may prove beneficitial. For example, methyl alcohol becomes active only after it is converted to
formaldehyde and formic acid; administering ethyl alcohol to the patient takes advantage of
substrate competition (it is favored over methyl alcohol by the enzymatic processes involved),
permitting significant reduction in the rate of metabolism and resulting in diminished formation of
formic acid."

Also see volume II, page 2070, table 457-10: Common Drug Poisonings, Signs
of Toxicity, and Treatment: Acid-Forming Intoxicants.

Finally, in my defense I'd like to point out that I do this for a living. (Treat poisonings and other
emergencies, that is--not the giving out booze part. Except, of course, when it's necessary. Whew!
I need a drink).
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