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The Western Canon Mailing List
Moderator: Paul John Barnette Jr.
Activation Date: March 8, 1997
Current Date:  August 20, 1997
Current Membership: 100
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Response to Western Canon #081

>One approach to Machiavelli is a variation on Pascal's gamble.  His
>gamble said that you can either believe in God or not.  If you don't &
>there is no God, you have gained nothing.  If you don't & there is a
>God, you will pay dearly.  If you believe & there isn't a God you have
>lost nothing.  If you believe & there is a God you win bigtime.
>
>Remember that Machiavelli says one must be
>prepared to be bad if the situation calls for
>it..he doesn't tell us to start out being bad.
>
>So the Machiavellian gamble is this:
>
>If you are not Machiavellian & men are good, things work out.  If they
>are bad, you have lost big time.  If you are Machiavellian & men are
>good you win because you don't need to be bad.  If they are bad, you do
>your fear thing & the state is secure.  Seems to me you play the odds.

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Why do you suppose that there are virtually no more Princes in power today?


>Response to Western Canon #079
>
>Congratulations to Mr. Sutherland on his piece of 8/15.
>
>I can't do justice to all of it, but continue to believe that
>Machiavelli arouses us because he presents us with the conflict of
>incompatible ends (security vs. justice, the closed vs. the open
>state, love vs fear) & while extolling Chrsitian virtues suggests that
>the Prince simply can't run a state that way.  And, as opposed to
>"others" who present us with theory, gives us a number of examples to
>illustrate his point.
>
>Do we beat on this messenger because he is wrong or because we find
>his conclusions distasteful?

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Let us suppose that all Machiavelli is saying, is how one who has power
should act in order to keep it. Isn't the desire for power itself a wrong
desire?

Adler/Weismann

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